MartyrMade Podcast #5 – Things Fall Apart

fearloathingnew

My laptop literally died a horrible death as I was uploading this episode, and I’m at a Kinkos finishing this post. Once I have a computer, I’ll get the stuff up. The things I do for y’all…

Riots. Massacres. The end of the world and everything in it. Palestinian Arabs finally find a voice in the wake of the 1929 massacres. Unable and unwilling to find a place for the Jews, Europe’s autoimmune disorder begins to tear the host apart. Desperate European Jews seek escape from Nazi persecution just as Palestinian resistance stiffens and the British become skeptical of the Zionist project.

Listen on iTunes

Listen on Stitchr

 

  1. I don’t care about your computer woes just give me my episode! Just kidding Coop, keep up the good work. I try to tell anyone and everyone about your podcast. I’m not sure if i’ve put a dent in your subscriber base but those of us who are keeping up definitely appreciate your efforts!

  2. I think its clear that you are biased toward to the Arabs. You use words like “kill” or “militant” when narrating their actions, but “murder” or “terrorist” when speaking about the Zionists. Maybe if you start the Podcast off by explaining your sympathies for the Arabs it would diffuse the expectation for impartiality and make this desperate treatment less jarring. .

    • I suppose that’s one way to look at it. Unfortunately this is a conflict where merely trying to imagine the perspective of the other side is interpreted as bias by the other side. I spent the first several episodes laying out in gory detail the rape and murder of Jews by Arabs in the Nebi Musa, Jaffa, and 1929 riots, and you cheered on my objectivity. The moment I lay out historical facts that you’re uncomfortable with, I’m “obviously” biased in favor of the Arabs. I’m used to it by now. 🙂

      • Hmm not sure I ever accused you of being objective 🙂 Even where you describe Arab on Jew/Zionist violence, you spend a lot of time explaining and humanizing the Arab perspective, which is fine, but I’m not sure that you do the same with the Jewish/Zionist perspective. Maybe you think that by stressing the level of persecution in Europe you are providing the Zionist perspective, but many Zionists, especially those in Betar and later Lehi, were motivated by a genuine desire to liberate their homeland from foreign rule and re-establish a Jewish commonwealth in Palestine irrespective of the Jewish situation in Europe. And many Mizrahi Jews from Palestine and surrounding Arab lands joined their cause.

  3. So you’ve mentioned that the last episode of this series is in the works, any ideas for your next subject? Personally, I think a history of the American South would be quite suited to your perspective. From the first slave ships and settlers, to the war, to the MLK era. Whatever it is you do, I’m excited already, you’re doing great work.

    • Great idea. It could run along the same structure as the zionist/arab conflict, in that tracing the roots black mob violence and their culture of murder/revenge/gang tribalism from their tribal roots in Africa through slavery, reconstruction, the civil rights movement, culminating in disorganized armed insurrection and atrocities that we saw in LA and St. Louis.

  4. Great show! Can you link the podcast you recommended at the start of this episode?

  5. Incredible episode as always.
    I actually joined the IDF not too long ago and finished listening to this while at the base.

    Thank you for this amazing work

    • All politics aside, I have a tremendous amount of respect for the IDF. I am a veteran and have worked a lot with the IDF in my current job with the US Department of Defense, and they’re the only “western” military with professionalism to match the Americans (in the general forces, I mean; many countries have brilliant units).

  6. Loved this episode!

    Loved the exploration of diaspora life as it applied to Jews and other non labour migrant communities – What did you call them middle men diasporas?
    That added a whole level of depth to the exploration of central issues of Jewish identity.

    Loved the in depth exploration of Jewish life in the Ottoman empire – including letters from the time.

    The in depth look at Al-qassam was probably the highlight of the episode, followed closely by your brutally unblinking look at the response to the Peel commission and the British response to the uprisings.

    Also loved the big picture look back at the Napoleonic incursion and your deep and thoughtful understanding of Hitler and his perspective.

    This is a 5 star Michellin rated podcast.

  7. A few comments:
    1) From the undertone you are accusing the Zionists for ingratitude towards the British. But the whole urging point of the Zionist project was to allow a mass flow of Jews from Europe before it erupts (whether this is a full sovereign state, and what is the exact boundaries were up to debate). Any solution that hindered that (including a joint government with the Arabs where the Jews are a minority) would damage the main cause. So for the British especially at this time, to put caps and enforce them! was indeed a betrayal (couldn’t they have turned a blind eye to illegal immigration?)
    2) Also the arabs are to be blamed – they could have agreed to Jewish flow to an isolated part of the country (Sinai? the Negev?), insisting that the immigrants stay there. With modern techniques, these areas could flourish (as indeed they are today) and the arabs wouldn’t have lost anything (as these were mauut lands)
    3) You put a lot of fault on the Irgun for indiscriminate terror attacks. While I do agree that morally they were wrong, a counter argument is that in a tribal area blood feuds might be considered even moral obligations, to revenge and deter future attacks (if you can read hebrew an interesting summary of attacks are at: http://www.gilihaskin.com/%D7%94%D7%90%D7%A6%D7%9C-%D7%94%D7%94%D7%91%D7%9C%D7%92%D7%94-%D7%95%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%A1%D7%A8-%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%99%D7%9E%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%AA%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%9E%D7%A8%D7%93/)
    4) Regarding Arlozorov death, there were conspiracy theories at the time (which I don’t believe but are 80 year old gossip …) that Nazi agents murdered Arlozorov to cover up that he was the childhood intimate friend (and maybe lover?) of Megda Goebells
    5) The displacement of local population – wasn’t this phenomenon happening all over the middle east (and the world) were people would move from villages to main cities?

  8. Hi Daryll,

    you brought up the fact that modern Israel uses a criteria for identifying Jews that was similar to the criteria used by the Nazi’s as evidence of ideological similarity. While I’ll concede that there were ideological similarities between the movements and their conception of Jews, both being European ethnic nationalist movements, I do think it is unfair not to mention that the reason modern Israel embraces this definition of Judaism is precisely because the Nazi’s did.

    When Israel amended their criteria for Judaism with respect to the law of return in 1970 to those matching the Nuremberg laws, they did so not because they appreciated Nazi ideology, but because their intent was to save the people the Nazi’s would have killed from persecution regardless of whether they’re halakhically Jewish.

    Thanks for recording this series, I’ve really enjoyed it so far and I’m looking forward to finishing this episode.

    • Hi Maxwell,

      If that implication was possible from what I said, it was certainly a mistake. I definitely did not mean to imply that Israel in any way adopted its definition from the Nazis. I’ll mention it in the Q&A episode. Thanks for the heads up, though.

  9. This is for your Q&A session. I’ve got quite a few questions for you, feel free to ignore any number of them. Thanks for recording this series, I’ve learned a lot.

    1) The recurring question of this podcast was “what would you have done?”. I’d like to pose that question to you.

    What would you have done if you had been in the position of each of these leaders from the early 1930’s up until the late 1940’s, knowing everything you do today and with all of your own personal preferences and values. In other words, imagine that your mind has been transported back in time into these leaders’ bodies.

    1.a) Chaim Weizmann

    1.b) Amin al-Husseini

    1.c) Winston Churchil

    1.d) King Abdullah

    2) You note that in order for us to achieve peace we should let go of our paranoia, citing the examples of anti-semitic conspiracy theories of global Jewish domination and the belief that Palestinians purposefully put their children in harm’s way.

    I agree with you, but this statement seems a bit out of place in the context of the rest of this podcast.

    In this podcast, you describe how zionism was able to take hold in Palestine due to a conspiracy to control the information flow to British and American government officials, orchestrated by zionist leaders.

    On the other hand, while you didn’t mention it, there are well documented cases of Palestinians using hospitals and schools as weapons caches and rocket launch sites, as well as instances of child suicide bombers and ambulance suicide bombings.

    To me these types of paranoia seem harder to resist because there are elements of truth to them. Do you agree?

    3) Why do you think this conflict receives so much more attention than other conflicts throughout the world? Is this conflict more worthy of our attention than other comparable and arguable more severe conflicts e.g. the Congolese civil wars, Indio Pakistani wars etc.

    Are we more interested because we perceive Israelis to be European, or maybe because they nominally serve US interests and receive a great deal of foreign aid?

    4) How do you think the conflict will end, and what do you think Israeli leadership should do in order to best facilitate the end of the conflict?

  10. I’m absolutely impressed with what you’re sharing here. You’ve definitely filled in a void where I was too lazy to read a book and do my own research. Do you think you can provide us with s link to the podcast of your friend you mentioned at the beginning of the latest episode? I’ve been spreading the word of your fine work, thanks for sharing and a patreon donation is headed your way.

  11. Darryl, loving the podcasts, keep them coming. I’d thought I understood this subject quite well, but you’ve reminded me just how many views and perspectives there are.

    Can you tell us about the music that you’ve used to end the episodes? It’s very appropriate to the mood.

  12. Hi Darryl,

    You have done a spectacular job of pacing and explaining the conflict. A question/observation:

    The Jewish state seems to ride the the fence between instability and stability. The Zionist project (and Israeli now) required a combination of global financial networks, high level diplomacy, and other things you have already spelled out. Is this un-natural or unsustainable in the long run? Has this vague idea of un-naturalness been a thread in Jewish endeavors? Do you see a broader pattern in ideas like monotheism and Zionism? As a Jew I get this feeling, that we have been obdurate to “Nature” from the beginning.

    Best,
    Sam

  13. Daryl. How many episodes do you plan on making? And when you are finished, do you plan to do podcasts on other topics? I really enjoy them

    • Cernovich: Yes, I’m working on the last official episode of this series now, almost finished, then I’ll push out a Q&A shortly after. At some point I’ll push out a history of the Jews in Europe, focusing on the mutual hostility that developed between their communities and many local populations, and how/why that led up to the Russian Revolution & Holocaust. I’ve got a few more singles queued up, and I want to get all of this done by the end of the year. After that I’m collaborating with a friend on a three-part series on the Spanish conquest of the Aztec Empire (around beginning of 2017).

      Glad you’re enjoying it. It’s still a surprise every time someone listens to me talk, not sure I’ll get used to it.

  14. Hey! I love the podcast; where are you in the process with the next episode? It’s been sooooo long. What can i do to speed up the process? Donate more money? Read some books for you? 😁

    Thank you for a great podcast, sry for preassure!

    • Ha! I probably could use a research assistant or two! Honestly, my day job work schedule has been brutal and I was in the middle of a move, so I got delayed. Plus I was probably putting a little too much pressure on this episode, since it’s the last of this series. But I’ve got it worked out now, and am working steadily. I need to stop predicting dates I’ll finish things, because life always interrupts (I would give anything to be able to do this full time like some of the others out there!), but I expect it to be done soon, hopefully before the end of the month.

      • We would like to see you do this full time too Daryll. But then you will have to stop being so modest and put it to your listeners to fund that ambition! I for one think you have it in you…Let out your inner entrepreneur!

      • Hate to do this, but end of the month has come and gone. I need my geopolitical-cultureclashing-swashbucklin’-awesomeness-fix!? How’s it going? Are you ok? Don’t let the preassure get to you – you’re great!

  15. Hi Darryl – Just wanted to stop by with two thoughts:
    1) Fantastic treatment of the history and genesis of the current crisis! I was looking for an overview for an upcoming trip to ramallah when I stumbled across your podcast. Really really excellent work
    2) The whole series could benefit from being broken up a bit more, 1 to 1.5 hours per show is more manageable than a 5 hour wallop of an episode.

    Keep up the good work!

  16. I am have something very short and simple to say, but I am going to pause for effect:

    You…have…enlightened…me.

    Thank you.

  17. I am just an uninformed wayfarer when it comes to this historical story. You are changing that by offering this podcast. I am happy to admit you brought tears to my eyes with the beautifully written and mixed ending of episode 4. Mr. Cooper, I honestly cannot remember the last time I cried but you brought it out of me this morning. Good luck with this important project. Sincerely, Colin.

  18. I don’t think you understand the amount of gratitude that’s out there for Martyrmade. You’ve achieved something remarkable with your telling of this story. It’s really too much for words.
    Somehow I’ve recovered sufficiently from episode 5 and am now ready to restart episode 1, this time to take notes.